Talk:SPLTstyle
From Spearfish Lake Tales Wiki
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Steve | Steve | ||
| + | == Category usage == | ||
| + | --[[User:SPLTWikiSysop|SPLTWikiSysop]] 01:49, 19 May 2009 (UTC) | ||
| + | <br>Can't figure out why this page is included in the Characters category. If anything it should be the [[SPLTstyle]] page rather than the talk about the style? | ||
| + | |||
| + | Also a short category has been created but not developed to list the short stories as opposed to the book category. I'm inclined to just include the stort stories in with the books. Perhaps it should be a subcategory of the book category. | ||
Revision as of 01:49, 19 May 2009
Discussion about styles used in Spearfish Lake Tales Wiki
Style questions, suggestions, comments are welcomed!
Welcome:
We need to bring the discussion of problems, bugs and how to do things to this discussion area so that we do not clutter up the forum too much. the forum needs to be for what Wes intended. A place to discuss the stories.
The Editors
Suggestion for handling characters with multiple names.
sjl 5/18/2009
How about using Wiki redirect pages for characters with multiple names (maiden/married names), nicknames, etc.? Just to try it out, I created a link for Caserowski, Linda that redirects to Clark, Linda. Note that if you click on these two links, they will both take to to the Clark, Linda page, and with the first link there will be a line at the top showing where it was redirected from. You can click on the link in that line to get to the redirecting page, and edit it to see what is in the page. That way all info for a character can be included in one page, and will be displayed no matter which name is used to get there.
If we go with this, we might want to come up with with some kind of standard or recommendation as to which page should have the full info in it -- or maybe not, since the information will be accessible regardless of what link is used to access it, and it shouldn't be too difficult for editors to find the right file to edit. I don't have any strong feelings one way or the other.
I did find one thing out -- you shouldn't redirect to a page that is another redirect page. To try this out, I created a page for Linda Caserowski. I initially created this page to redirect to "Caserowski, Linda". When it was set up this way, going to Linda Caserowski showed a page with the redirect to "Clark, Linda", and I had to click on that to get to the real info. Note that in this file, I did not include the CATEGORY tag, so it doesn't clutter up the Characters page.
Redirects could also be used to create links in first name last name format to make it easier to include links in the articles and for searches (like I did with Linda Caserowski just for testing purposes).
Steve
Personally I think that is a good idea. It would fix the one thing I don't like about the current standard which is information split between pages.
Mike, would it be too hard to make this change now before things get too much further along?
Kirby
I'm not Mike, but I don't think there are that many character pages created yet that would be affected. I'll even volunteer to go in and make whatever changes are needed if you want. There should probably be an update to the instructions for creating character pages to reflect this.
Steve
Steve:
Let's get Mike's input before we do since he is the primary coder on this project.
Kirby
As has been found out, multiple redirects aren't practical in mediawiki.
The prime reason for the redirect function from what I have seen is to deal with pages that have been misnamed. It allows for the old name to point somewhere - the proper place - rather than be an orphan link which all instances of which would have needed to be changed.
Extra pages in a wiki are not burdensome. With the proper links at and from a page I have no problem with extras such as the nickname pages - but redirects don't affect the page count.
Since for instance for Judy Sorensen redirecting to Judith Sorensen, etc. it is no real storage difference, I have no strong preference.
Given that some people both have discovered redirection, why not? As long as the and ones for the appropriate book(s) are included, sure. We need to make sure that on the real page, say for Judith Sorensen, all the nicknames are included.
This does lead to the question about maiden/married names. Since Judith Niven is a character should their only be a redirect to Judith Sorensen? This leads to unnecessary spoilers!
Bottom line, programming it makes no difference to me. Stylistically, it hadn't occurred to me. If one or more people feel strongly about it, go ahead! Just write the style down somewhere - for now at least here on SPLTstyle.
Maybe we are about at the point where we need a separate SPLTcharacterstyle page, too! (Maybe even a character template.)
thanks Michael Slade
My observations on Mikes comments:
I am not sure that redirects are primarily for renamed pages, although I did notice that the pages that I renamed (moved) due to a misspelled name, there is a redirect under the old name. I stumbled on while looking up something in Wikipedia, and noticed that I ended up in a different page than I thought I would. I saw the redirect notice, and being curious, went in to find out how it was done. The light bulb went on, and I thought it might be useful here. Lest I come across as being any kind of Wiki expert, I should mention that until I looked at this project, I had never so much as looked at the page source for a Wiki page, let alone tried any editing. So I'm just kinda stumbling around here and hoping that someone will set me straight if I head off down the wrong path.
As for spoilers, I can't really get too excited about that. There is a spoiler warning on the main page, and there are likely to be spoilers for maiden/married names in the character pages even if they are separate pages. My view of SPLTWiki, rightly or wrongly, is that it will be more useful to readers who are familiar with the stories and are rereading them or trying to cross-check something between stories, than it would be to a first-time reader.
Here is my take on how this could be approached:
Create a page under the name first used for the character (for example, Niven, Judith). This page should include all names and nicknames for that character. It should also have a Category: tag for Characters and for each book the character appears in.
Create a page under all other names/nicknames used for the character in lastname,firstname format, containing a redirect to the first page, and also Category tags for Characters and for each book the character appears in under that name. (I don't think it would be useful to have Judith Niven appear by that name in the character list for Facing the Storm, for example).
(This next part I am not sure about. It may be overkill, and it would be a little extra work for whoever is setting up a new character, but it could be useful for linking and for searches):
Create pages for any minor variations on the name with a redirect to the first page, but WITHOUT Category tags. (This would probably not apply to very many characters). Examples would be Niven, Judy and Sorensen, Judy. Then, do the same in firstname lastname format for all names: Judith Niven, Judy Niven, Judith Sorensen, Judy Sorensen.
(And more that I am not sure about:)
Create a page with only a redirect using the character's first name (or names, as Judith, Judy). This could be useful in searches, because a lot of the stories only refer to a character by first name (I suspect there are characters for whom we have not (yet) seen a last name.) Most of the characters, so far anyway, have first names that are unique within the SPLT universe. Not totally true, I believe there are at least 2 Bob's, and probably other examples as well. Wiki has a disambiguation feature that would probably cover these cases, but I have no idea how it would be set up or if it is worth it.
Now, on a different topic: Perhaps it would be a good idea to put a strongly-worded suggestion on the instruction pages to PLEASE double and triple check the spelling of names, books, etc. when creating new pages. I have fixed at least 3 character pages that were created under a misspelled name, and I know others have done the same as well.
Steve
Category usage
--SPLTWikiSysop 01:49, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
Can't figure out why this page is included in the Characters category. If anything it should be the SPLTstyle page rather than the talk about the style?
Also a short category has been created but not developed to list the short stories as opposed to the book category. I'm inclined to just include the stort stories in with the books. Perhaps it should be a subcategory of the book category.
